Jaume
comments regarding UUA:
Unless American UUism makes a decision about whether they are a single body, or a conglomeration of congregations, associations, or religions, it will be hard to be relevant and to speak with a single, consistent voice.
My
Church associates each Sunday
...not as agreeing in opinion, not as having attained universal truth in belief or perfection in character, but as seekers after truth and goodness.
We're relevant without speaking in a single or consistent voice. Why should UUA latch relevancy to unity, or need a single and consistent voice? And who would enforce that single voice consistent over time? Unitarianism has hardly been that and many Liberals would argue progress is all about the evolution (change) of that voice over time. Tomorrow's voice carries more wisdom than yesterday's and change is good. Not sure I buy that, but it's case against the strait jacket of consistency.
7 comments:
According to the Washington advocacy office, we DO speak with one voice- or at least that's how the faxes they send our congressmen are worded.
Apparently Jaume de Marcos needs to do some more research into U*U history. . . He might also want to look up the meaning of the words 'association' and 'polity' in a good dictionary.
Bill, it is just a suggestion, but of course the UUA and your congregation can do whatever you want. I personally do not see that UUism, or Unitarianism worldwide, is relevant at all. We are hardly a footnote in the history of religion. The other possibility is that UUs do not want, or cannot, be relevant beyond your local neighborhood. There are dogmas that are not theological, but of other kinds and ways.
Robin, thank you for your encouragement. I do try to learn a bit more every day about U+U history, that is why I have already published a book on that subject, and have been given lectures during the past three years. Have you?
By the way, if someone needs to learn about what congregational polity is, it's you. Remember your love affair with the Montreal church and Rev. Drennan? You have my full support in your learning process, Robin, as always.
Jaume,
Can you elaborate a bit on this,
I personally do not see that UUism, or Unitarianism worldwide, is relevant at all.
What kind of relevancy are you looking for here? Or do you think we've had in the past and have now lost? I can't see where you want to take us.
Jaume de Marcos Andreu said...
:Robin, thank you for your encouragement.
You're welcome Jaume. Anytime. . .
:I do try to learn a bit more every day about U+U history,
You seem to try to suppress unflattering U*U history from time to time Jaume. Have you learned anything interesting about the seemingly credible allegations of various German anti-racist and anti-fascist groups that the German Unitarian religious community was "steeplejacked" by Nazi ideologues, including former SS officers who were convicted war criminals? Maybe you should research and write a book about that fascinating aspect of U*U history some time Jaume. . . You can start your free and responsible search for the truth and meaning (or possible lack thereof) of those disturbing allegations about the Deutsche Unitarier Religionsgemeinschaft and Bund Deutscher Unitarier which split off from the DUR in the 1980's. I look forward to seeing it published some time.
:that is why I have already published a book on that subject,
I am quite aware that you published a book about one rather ancient "famous Unitarian" who got into a spot of trouble with Calvin for pointing out apparent flaws in Christian theology Jaume, but you seem to be rather ignorant of more recent U*U history particularly in terms of the UUA's policy of "congregational polity". This is precisely why I suggested that you need to do some more research into U*U history. . . In fact, considering that you are something of a U*U historian, your apparent ignorance of such fundamental policies of U*Uism is somewhat surprising.
:and have been given lectures during the past three years. Have you?
I quite regularly give lectures about U*U history on The Emerson Avenger blog and as comments on other blogs etc. I can't imagine that you would want me delivering such lectures more publicly Jaume but perhaps one day I will. In fact I intend to do some more research into those allegations about alleged "Nazi Unit-Aryans" in the Deutsche Unitarier Religionsgemeinschaft aka DUR and Bund Deutscher Unitarierand aka BDU and post the results of that free and responsible search for truth and meaning it in the coming months. Maybe I will get around to throwing that book at U*Us before you do Jaume. . .
:By the way, if someone needs to learn about what congregational polity is, it's you. Remember your love affair with the Montreal church and Rev. Drennan?
Actually I have learned a fair bit about the seamy underbelly of "congregational polity" the hard way Jaume. Indeed my ongoing "love affair" with the Unitarian Church of Montreal and Rev. Ray Drennan actually shows that "congregational polity" allows rogue U*U ministers and rogue U*U congregations to "get away with murder" to say nothing of character assassination. But you should know that my "love affair" extends to the UUA, its department of ministry, the Ministerial Fellowship Committee and UUMA, and more recently, the UUA's department of Congregational Services. All of these bodies hold responsibility for dealing appropriately with clergy misconduct and have abjectly failed and obstinately refused to responsibly redress by serious grievances about Rev. Ray Drennan's intolerant and abusive clergy misconduct. In fact the UUA has a terrible track record when it comes to providing genuine restorative justice to victims of clergy misconduct, including clergy sexual misconduct Jaume. Perhaps you should write a book about that. . .
:You have my full support in your learning process, Robin, as always.
Of course Jaume. No doubt, you consider your "memory holing" of my critical comments on your blog to be part of that "learning process". Of course that "learning process" is a two_way street Jaume and I have done my fair share of teaching U*Us some lessons that they need to learn. It is most regrettable that U*Us are such slow learners though. . . I guess that U*Us will have to live and learn some more before our little "love affair" ends in divorce.
Bill, I was not aware of your question at the comments section of the "UUA Presidential Debate 2009" blog. I have answered there but now I am copying my answer here for you, just in case you cannot check it yourself there:
"Hill Bill,
Sorry for being so late in answering, but I feel that I need to clarify it. I am not cheering for Peter Morales or anybody else because I am currently the Secretary of the International Council of Unitarians and Universalists (ICUU) until its 2009 meeting, that will take place anyway after the UUA election. I may speak my mind after I leave office (if anybody still cares about it at all) in my Hanif blog (currently in frozen state) in thehanifblog.blogspot.com"
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